Periphery guitarist Misha Mansoor has sparked discussion online following a recent in-depth conversation regarding the increasingly difficult economics of touring for modern bands.
Mansoor has spoken openly about the financial realities of the music industry for years. Back in 2018, he described Periphery as more of a “passion project” than a primary income source, while encouraging younger musicians to establish additional revenue streams outside of their bands.
Over the years, Mansoor has built several businesses alongside his music career, including 3DOT Recordings, GetGood Drums, Horizon Devices, and various merchandise-related ventures.
Appearing on a recent episode of the Nik Nocturnal podcast, Mansoor explained that he believes those earlier warnings about relying solely on touring income are “more relevant than ever” in today’s climate.
“People always got the wrong message from what I was saying… my point was like, ‘Hey you’re going to need side hustles.’ You’re going to need income streams and those take a while to build and to bear fruit, if they’re going to bear any at all. So start early.”
Mansoor went on to explain that he wasn’t criticizing Periphery for not generating enough money on its own, but instead viewed the band as the creative foundation that allowed other ventures to grow around it.
“I don’t care that I don’t make money with Periphery, because I use it as the nucleus for all my other stuff that does make me money so that I can have a life.”
Much of the discussion centered around the rapidly increasing costs associated with touring in the post-pandemic era, including transportation, crew wages, and production expenses.
“The costs of everything have like doubled to tripled. The cost of everything.”
“Our guarantees continue to go up, up and up, great. But they don’t get as much mileage as you would think, because the cost of everything is so much higher.”
Mansoor also detailed how those rising costs impact support acts and touring packages overall, explaining that many smaller bands are asking for larger guarantees simply to remain financially viable on the road.
“There’s just not enough money to go around… what’s left over for the band is usually little to nothing.”
He later reiterated that his advice to younger artists was less about pessimism and more about long-term sustainability.
“Your band’s not going to make any money. Do the other stuff… Who knows where that leads?”
Mansoor’s comments later drew criticism from Fit For A King bassist/vocalist Ryan “Tuck” O’Leary, who disagreed with the outlook presented during the discussion.
Posting on social media yesterday, May 11th, Tuck wrote:
“Rich guy in a band said you need a side hustle because he doesn’t understand how budgets work. @NikNocturnal talk to someone that’s not a fucking idiot and actually makes a living touring. This rhetoric is unhealthy for young musicians.”
The exchange generated wider discussion online surrounding the current state of touring economics, particularly as more artists across the heavy music scene have publicly spoken about rising operational costs over the past several years.
Notably, both musicians themselves maintain careers and business ventures outside of touring. Alongside his work in Fit For A King, Tuck also works with Beacon Management and co-founded Papercut Recordings in 2025.
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That’s wild, jump right in with an insult because someone else’s experience led them to a different conclusion than you? I think it’s an honest answer from misha, side hustles and other creations to feed you, free up the band and opens you up to more possibilities.
Andy Lucas 💯
Andy Lucas that’s because Misha is a trust fund baby. It’s insulting for him to give advice on money to actual struggling artists. Welcome to the Internet there’s a lot of information on here. Whomp whomp
Andy Lucas it actually gets in the way tbh
Kevin Leazottif you suck at managing yourself yeah
Andy Lucas if you need a day job you need to stay at your day job 🤷
Kevin Leazottthat’s some serious entitlement, to think that you get to set rules for other people, wild stuff.
Kevin Leazott It gets in the way if you suck at it.
Christian Kee nah nobody wants a half-assed musician, they need to be able to put you on the road and the road is where the money is as a musician.
Kevin Leazott You’re not very smart it appears. Even Tuck has a side job that he does while making music. Also Misha was saying to diversify your portfolio as the music money will dry up eventually. But yeah enjoy only focusing fully on music. I’m sure you’ll totally survive decades doing it.
Yeah I think Tuck is the one who’s out of touch here. “Just budget bro” good luck with that. I’m gonna take a shot in the dark and say FFAK being less niche and having double the monthly listeners (just for starters) might have something to do with their differing experiences…
Matthew Rees-Andrews good luck with budgeting? How? That’s like saying good luck brushing your teeth. you either do it or you don’t, and most metal bands aren’t doing extensive budgeting and that’s a fact, so you can either implement a skill, and get better at it, or stay stupid shit like “good luck with that” without applying any context as to why it may be difficult enough to warrant a defeated “good luck lol” outlook. Definitely not out of touch, just requires a level of work thats likely not attractive to just standing on stage and performing, it’s still a business
Matthew Rees-Andrews tuck also fronts a band that barely tours so even if he doesn’t get a ton of money from streams, he is still making straight money off of it with little to no touring costs.
Ben Biles He’s a bassist. His opinion doesn’t count 😂
Matthew Rees-Andrews You think FFAK is larger than Periphery? They may have more listeners now, doesn’t mean that has always been the case at all. Tuck has been in FFAK since 2016, they were a much smaller band than Periphery before.
they also tour insanely much, it feels like FFAK has been on the road two years straight. while sure one month long tour can’t sustain anyone, it’s insane to expect every band can play 100+ shows every year, especially if they are not from US and tours kinda have to be international, not domestic
Tuck is just mad that some people like misha actually play their instruments instead of spinning around like a roided beyblade whilst he bass is played on the backing track
Haha yes, saw those guys live a few years ago while they were opening for TAIM, that dude wouldn’t stop spinning all the time
Shhhhh, we don’t speak about the backing track 😂
Matt Teal half of these bands would be nothing without their backing tracks
This 🤣🤣
Xyluss K Nelms I damn near chocked reading this 🤣. This is what i always thought of him 😂
Media: https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia2.giphy.com%2Fmedia%2Fv1.Y2lkPTEyMGMwMTQ3enQycWtwczh2MDZvYnZma2J2ZDh5NjJkdjNxZ2ViOWFnYjd4bm5nciZlcD12MV9naWZzX3NlYXJjaCZjdD1n%2FduM6JZemPlOjUyqmxd%2Fgiphy.gif&h=AUAJ1SRSq0jzkPxFnNpCjFH2g_u9okhZb6sQBP4_L1qOm4sRImTo-5z1NF3Qgx4dJwqPCvQgEeKl_yFDQTqU_rUEmmWc-V-QkzQMuClnKid8v9L-sCCLBn_6FTtuRzC7&s=1
Fit for a king is the worst band I’ve ever seen live. Least enjoyable experience
Sam Lorenzo tuck ain’t even playing live he just spins and sweats all over the place like a maniac
Zico Hua he managed to play 0 notes and all spins
Sam Lorenzo I literally watched it in person too and it was unbelievable to how much sweat was coming out of this man and it was winter too
Zico Hua bros got a bad vibe fr
This Tuck dude is a fool.
To simultaneously refer to Misha as a “rich guy in a band” and also say he knows nothing about tour budgeting is so hilarious.
As if Misha hasn’t been in a touring band for like 20 years and as if actually becoming wealthy at the same time doesn’t give him any insight on how musicians should operate their bands and touring.
Listen to Tuck if you want to struggle and just do okay while being away from your home for 80% of the year, never earning enough to truly be wealthy, and eventually having to get a job at guitar center when you’re too old to tour anymore.
Also claiming that telling artists to be entrepreneurial is toxic advice is laughable.
Just budget, or change your style to be mass marketable and indistinguishable from the rest of the genre. Just give up your original musicality and you can make it bro I promise
Mace Smith #JustBaldGingerThoughts
Color me surprised the FFAK is bigger than Periphery. I never knew
Joseph Salvatori if you would have said this would happen back in 2014-16, people would have thought you were insane. Still blows my mind to see how big some of these bands have gotten.
I totally interpreted this as tuck is jealous that misha is more successful than him.
Kolby Duncan Thompson he’s jealous misha contributes to his bands songs and has a meaningful impact in the band. Misha plays his guitar for real and tuck is just doing sweaty beyblade spins whilst the bass is on the backing track where someone else programmed the midi or someone else in the studio performed the bass and he is more or less a sweaty spinning mascot of his band where he just mimes and spins
Whole heartedly agree
Zico Hua probably programmed using GGD too no less lol
Kolby Duncan Thompson right more plays but makes less money
Wait wait wait……..FFAK is more popular in streaming numbers than periphery??
Parker Ryan double on Spotify. 1.1M for FFAK and 550K for periphery
Jeff Shepherd insane
Parker Ryan this new generation of metal lovers haven’t really latched on to Periph like we did in the 2010’s
Honestly I’m shocked Periphery’s monthly listener numbers are always solo. 
You’d think their music would be more accessible with how catch either choruses are , but they always throw random jazz interludes, long intros/outros, random unneeded Djent riffs that stuff turns off casual listeners and people who aren’t guitar nerds. Sumarian Records dropped them for that exact reason. Periphery could absolutely be more popular if they wanted to, but the band is a passion project so they just write whatever they want.
Chris Costa Carneiro it’s too technical for 80% of peoples brains to causally listen to. I love both bands but FFAK definitely does the main stream act way better
While that’s true, it’s also ironic because sounds like Scarlett, Icarus Lives, Alpha, Marigold, Jetpacks Was Yes are absolutely accessible for casual metal listeners. If they just tightened up the rest of their songs and we’re marketed better they could be absolutely huge. 
Parker Ryan why is that insane?
Josh Steele interesting take. Most of peripherys fans ive ran into seem to be under 25
Chris Costa Carneiro Ash from Sumerian was trying to push them towards accessibility because they “could’ve been a stadium band”, but that’s not what the Periphery guys wanted out of the band. Periphery never ‘sold out’ and they didn’t need to because of their side hustles and brand collabs. With that being said, I’m really shocked that songs like Scarlet, Dying Star, and even their latest single haven’t properly caught onto the mainstream scene.
Kyle Norbury because FFAK isnt really that good lol
Jeff Shepherd but you have to take into account that those numbers on Spotify change every month. You can have millions one month and 500,000 the next depending upon active streaming.
Brian Olson I assure you no one is going from millions to 500K in a month. And even still, it’s the most important metric the industry uses to gauge your possible turnout.
Jeff Shepherd “Most important metric”
I prefer musicians who actually play music and not the fame game. Taylor Swift may have 6billion plays but none of those are from me.
Most important metric, my ass.
Christian Kee Most important metric to musicians who actually want to play live shows and make a living. But go off on your tangent about Taylor Swift if it makes you feel better, buddy. 😂
You also kind of proved my point about turnout by bringing her up 😂. Thanks
Chris Costa Carneiro they put a low ceiling on the band the day they hired such a terrible vocalist. Periphery opens for bands they inspired, playing venues bigger than they ever played themselves. I thought they could have been huge too, but they decided to be a bunch of dorks and squander all that potential instead.
Jeff Shepherd Idk man maybe musicians should just play music and not try to be content creators? This world has built a lot of fake ass musicians.
Christian Kee idk man it seems like we live in a world where they can do both.. and it’s important for their growth that they do… 😂
Its insane because Periphery were the pioneers of an entire genre whereas FFAK are one of thousands of bands that share a sound with each other. Most self produced bedroom guitarists of the last 15 years learned from Misha
Parker Ryan streaming numbers dont matter. 1 million streams is $3k on Spotify and $6k on apple music
1 million streams on Spotify is anywhere between 3k & 8k depending on listener location, subscription level, artist royalty agreement, etc.
And also.. streaming numbers matter a lot lmao, it’s the most direct way of viewing an artist’s success
It’s arguably the most important metric
Tyler Morrison I played my own’s bands music on repeat for a week straight and now my plays are pretty sweet! I think I’m successful
Tyler Morrison not always. There’s artists with millions of monthly listeners that can’t fill a 300 cap room ironically. Meanwhile Phish has 500k monthly and sells out MSG multiple nights in a row 🤷♂️
Instead of saying it, actually give me an artist with “millions of monthly listeners that can’t fill a 300 cap room”
I’ll wait.
Nate Petit that wasn’t his point lol
Nate Petit that’s cope bro lol. If they didn’t matter then nobody would have their music on streaming sites.
Alex Irving its just a smaller piece of the puzzle is all. One night of merch sales tops that easy especially if they are playing festivals
Nate Petit music is what matters not fucking merch. The only people that buy band merch and don’t listen to the music are tourist posers lmfao
Tyler Morrison not at all dude streams are easily faked , it’s nowhere near a gauge of success
Alex Irving you obviously have no clue how a record deal works today thats cool. Keep it pushing.
If you actually knew your shit. Bands only get 1/4 of the royalties from streaming platforms, they keep 100% of the merch and 50% of the ticket sales depending on the deal. But thats the general consensus. You ever been signed, dont sound like it. Streaming numbers dont equate success. It equates popularity
Nate Petit I’m not even talking about that. You know just as much as I do bro. Please stfu lol
Nate Petit How does one play at major festivals without having streams? How are you going to get booked when you can’t show you’ll pull people in? To say it “doesn’t matter” is just silly. Does it make them the most money? No. Is it still very important regardless? absolutely.
Nate Petit you’ve never been signed either bro. You’re just coping at this point. First, you completely misunderstood me and then immediately started attacking me based of your own assumptions. You’re fucking weird and you don’t know shit. Also I have more money than you so get fucked
There are absolutely zero successful artists faking their stream counts, dude. That’s a local “pick me” artist who thinks you can fake viewer counts & fool the people that can see the ACTUAL metrics lmao
They’d get dropped from their label so quickly 😂😂😂
Nobody’s out here faking streams & actively touring and doing well for themselves 😂 0% brain power in that comment, too
If you actually knew your shit, you’d know that royalty deals vary band-to-band.
Also “streaming numbers don’t equate success. It equates popularity.” is the dumbest thing I’ve heard today
Popularity IS success in this industry, are you high?
lol dude you’re out here talking down at people & don’t have a clue what you’re even talking about.
Nate Petit say what? Bands keep 100% of merch sales? There are a lot of venues that take a portion of the band’s merch sales. So that’s not true at all. Someone always has their hand in your pocket.
Parker Ryan been around forever
Drew Shortfuse Lion I’ve seen them multiple times in their hometown area about 12 years ago lol, dont worry. I just think periphery are of a different caliber, so its surprising (but not) that they have more monthly streams
Parker Ryan Cookie cutter ahh metalcore band that did nothing inventive whatsoever and followed trends since day 1 is bigger and more popular? Who would’ve thought? 🤔🤔
Jun Rosas that’s what I point out. It’s quite sad.
Parker Ryan FUCK no 🤣
Dillon Hogan laughing at you, not with you. You’re letting your bias and preferences dictate facts. While Periphery may be more technical, and people love them, FFAK is huge. Period.
Doesn’t negate the fact that they’re as original an assembly line turd, and blow cocks for beer money
Jeff Shepherd i said it was a smaller piece in the puzzle of gauging success. Especially talking about 2 industry name bands
Nate Petit greedy ass promoters are notorious for hitting bands with a 20% mech cut these days. They don’t provide people running the merch booths or any services. It’s just like, oh here’s a dirty corner you can set up in and I’m going to take 20% for letting you exist.
Matthew Holveck yeah its pretty ridiculous. Like I know big festival promoters take 50% which is why merch at festivals is so ridiculous priced
Nate Petit the scene is so broken I can’t even just play for free without having to jump through hoops and sling tickets. I have a good job and love music, but quit playing because I didn’t need another full time job with no upside.
Matthew Holveck oh for sure my main focus with my band is content and online. Thats really where it is now sadly.
Parker Ryan Do you live under a rock? FFAK is huge
Well yeah. I haven’t even heard anyone even mention periphery in a long minute.
Misha has more talent in his pinky finger than that entire generic ass band
Misha having money or not, the industry is a meat grinder for smaller artists. Giving them the advice to diversify is smart. You have your head above water thanks to touring, cool story bro. Are you going to be able to retire comfortably though?
If he makes good money touring let’s hear how he does it. Tell your fellow artists what they are doing wrong.
Daren Walker I was a fan of Tucks podcast and he said that he loves when fans give him and the band trading cards and candy and so I went and gave him some and he was pretty ungrateful and then never responded ever again. Fuck that guy haha
Daren Walker Gotta do ballet and spin around onstage
Daren Walker the funny thing is, he has two side hustles alongside FFAK 🤣 idk why bro is so angry when Misha is right
It’s unhealthy for Misha to give advise but totally healthy for Tuck to insult him and give zero elaboration. Dude sounds like a tard.
This guy is becoming the new Paolo from Trivium 😂😂 straight to insults
Dustin Varner I am the only Paolo of Metal!Media: https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.1997-6/106421800_953852561743768_2258502540470753610_n.png?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=23dd7b&_nc_ohc=PrTAH6ZhA1IQ7kNvwFadTx-&_nc_oc=AdpbsmlfFlj5wOtePW5nyqLb7Q5jevV9rr4zo3MKE9Vxk6V6fnxLZp6trtUwaY-yuWo&_nc_zt=26&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.xx&edm=AOerShkEAAAA&_nc_gid=zcFbLw97v9ojEYoU4DOFmQ&_nc_tpa=Q5bMBQGmMOz4F0G_6xXjeLNm7TRpvMfeP21Z275KE3sBrs8I4YX4pmAb6eF-xR0pIYzbVRsm7bIHoOzmPg&oh=00_Af4Ei7oaXWPhch9-JcPtUYs2B71E0WlOXCVqvxJPNnUVmw&oe=6A09A4D7
Paolo Accomando Hell yeah buddy lol
Dustin Varner The human beyblade is upset
Periphery is Misha’s passion project so yeah FFAK is bigger but Periphery doesn’t make music for the same reasons Tuck does
Samwise Kindall *haunted shores is his passion project. Periphery turned into a metal core cash cow and the cows running dry 😑
Shayne Kolentik no, Periphery turned its members into a signature gear cash cow.
Paul Anderson so, basically what I just said. “Metal core” was a market. JFC I’m so tired of low IQ ahh heads 😑
Shayne Kolentik do you ever get the feeling that everyone you know talks shit about you behind your back?
Shayne Kolentik bullshit.
Shayne Kolentik I’m pretty sure Misha wishes periphery was the cash cow you think it is. Spoiler, it’s not.
Shayne Kolentik yikes
Shane haunted shores is Mark’s project actually.
Eric Arthur Villarreal facts lol.
Samwise Kindall his passion project is Bulb. Always was and always will be.
Alex Irvingbulb is his solo project, periphery is his passion project (he said that about periphery). He also said recently that “bulb” has ran its course and he’s going to stop going by that moniker.
Austin Zepeda he’s gonna stop going by it but he’s going to market his entire persona off of it. K. If you believe that then I have some fresh air to sell you lmfao
why don’t yall just ask the man himself instead of speaking for him? He has clearly stated a million times that Periphery is his passion project. it’s not what WE decide it is.
Alex IrvingI don’t really get what you’re trying to say. It almost sounds like you’re implying that the misha from bulb and the misha from periphery are two different independent people
Austin Zepeda I literally never even said anything close to that. So like idk learn to read English better. That’s on you lol
This is unfortunate, and I like both bands too.
What a fucking dumbass.
I thought that Misha’s explanation was really thoughtful and well presented. Not everyone’s situation is the same, but I felt it was good advice.
What a dumb take, maybe Glen Fricker was right all along.
Everybody’s situation is different though I will say that in this economy, I wouldn’t deem it safe to have one income. Especially if you have a wife and or kids.
Everything is just too expensive.
Mish is a trust fund baby his dads like the fucking treasurer of Mauritius
Tuck’s right, though. Misha (and Periphery as a whole) don’t focus at all on building the Periphery brand.
Fit For a King absolutely GRINDS when it comes to putting out music, promoting it, building on that base, etc.
Misha focuses his time & resources on the technical stuff, his plugins & various businesses, etc.
If Misha dedicated all of that into building Periphery, they could be rivaling FFAK (or probably surpassing them)
The difference is where they put their efforts.
That’s like In n’ Out burger saying “you can’t make money on fries, so focus on the burgers”
Well yeah, makes sense coming from in n out because they’ve NEVER decided to change how they make their shitty fries
Their burgers are fire tho
(Also I’m not saying Periphery is shitty, they’re absolutely fire, I’m just saying that Misha’s giving advice on an avenue that he himself hasn’t put NEARLY as much effort into as he has everything else)
Tyler Morrison Thank you
Marcel Diaz MIsha didn’ make periphery just to get rich amn
Tyler Morrison I think that’s by design though. If you think about it, the reason all of the members of Periphery can have lucrative side hustles is because of the personal clout they have built through the band. Making a living from personal endeavors, tied to the band but not exploitative of the band itself, insulates it from commercialism and allows it to be a much purer artistic expression. There is almost no effort to commodify the music of Periphery but it always highlights the virtuosity of the members. In fact, it seems like they are going out of their way to make it LESS commercial with each iteration, preserving the integrity of their vision.
The fact that the members of Periphery have built personal brands will give them more financial longevity and security, as they can continue to monetize if or when the band dissolves.
It’s a cool paradox: selling out personally to preserve collective artistic integrity.
I disagree that it’s by design, at least I don’t believe that’s how it started (otherwise Misha wouldn’t have this exact opinion about touring & side hustles)— I think the guys in Periphery are like most*** musicians in that they want to focus on the artistry with the music & don’t want to bother with all of the things that would make the band/(brand) bigger.
Most musicians today don’t want to do the hustle, the content creation (big one), the round-the-clock promoting, the brand building, etc.
Most musicians just want to write, release, & play music— this is the case with Periphery. I’ve never seen Periphery promote a single thing, I’ve never seen them hit content, hell I don’t even know what the guys look like tbh with you.
Periphery’s commercial success kinda came secondary to (or in-tandem with) their individual successes— especially in terms of high-quality plugins & such
These plugins don’t mean squat to listeners, but producers & other musicians picked them up & then the name “Periphery” got spread around along with the plugins
I heard of GetGoodDrums LOOOONG before I ever heard of Periphery, and the only reason I discovered them was because someone was like “yea, Nolly & Matt from a band called Periphery are behind this”
Periphery is only really popular amongst other musicians because of this, and like 70% of listeners have never even heard of them.
Bottom line is: Tuck’s completely right— Misha’s opinion on this matter has almost no value because Periphery’s commercial success is entirely circumstantial.
Their success was not driven by ANY of the same factors that drive 99% of successful artists.
It’s like asking a car enthusiast how to get from one state to another when you’re trying to be an aircraft pilot.
Sure, he got from point A to point B, but he’s never flown a plane in his life.
Paul Anderson This is a cool take.
Tyler Morrison I think you forget that FFAK has a massive record label fronting the costs of all their touring
Do you think that a label “fronting” all of those costs somehow make them go away? You do realize that any “fronted costs” need to be reimbursed right?
Do you understand what a record label does? Or how a loan works?
You put exactly 0% brain power into that comment, my man.
Tyler Misha has also stated that once music isn’t fun for him he doesn’t want to do it anymore. He wants music to be fun and not a job or an obligation.
Right— which feeds exactly into my point: Periphery doesn’t do any of the things that literally ALL other artists do to sustain & grow, and to make the band itself a successful commercial venture.
Periphery getting as big as they are now is purely circumstantial & thanks to their contributions to other musicians— this is why they’re stagnant & non-musicians have no idea who they are, because they’re not doing anything to grow the brand.
Tyler Morrison I disagree to some extent. I love both bands but to be honest, Periphery is a band that’s difficult to like compared to FFAK. Periphery is extremely instrumental and experimental in its nature, even among metal fans, they can be very polarizing. They don’t write music to be liked by people, they write music because they are music nerds. FFAK is much more “commercial” in terms of their music, they are incredible and powerful, but their production and song structures are waaaay trendier and much more likeable than Periphery. It’s not even hard to see objectively, you can take a look at Periphery, almost every album is very weird and experimental in its own way, FFAK have become increasingly commercial, like I said, nothing against it, I love the old and new stuff, but that means that in some ways they have to write music “To be liked” to be able to stay in the numbers they have. And again, I’m not saying one or the other is right or wrong, but I think it’s a pretty narrow minded from Tuck to criticize them because of it, it’s just another business model and way of thinking.
You’re both missing and highlighting my exact point— Misha’s opinion is worthless here because Periphery’s “success” is purely circumstantial.
Take away all of the software, businesses, and contributions they’ve made to the scene, leave only the music— Periphery would have nearly zero success.
Invent, Animate
Polyphia
Sleep Token
There’s three examples right off the dome of experimental bands that are successful
The difference is those guys do the grind to make the music successful
Misha is like every other guitarist that doesn’t want to do the content grind, doesn’t want music to “not be fun”, etc. The only reason they’ve gotten so big is because of plugins/software/etc.
They’d be able to make money doing the music too if they properly budgeted, however these millionaires have never had to, (and already live as millionaires) so they literally don’t know what they’re talking about when it comes to successful road life.
He said in the interview “I don’t care that I don’t make money in periphery”
That statement ends all argument, he literally stated IN the interview that there’s no motivation to make money from the band & it’s just for fun.
They’re rich hobbyists, not career musicians.
Tyler Morrison yet, with Periphery having half the monthly listeners FFAK does, Misha Mansoor likely has more money as one man than the entire FFAK crew combined. He might be on to something maybe.
I addressed literally all of that
Who’s the bald one
Guy in more popular band gets mad at guy in less popular band not being able to rely on touring alone to support family and self 🤦🏻♂️
In a nutshell basically
The bald one seems really butthurt and looks mad lol 😂
Joseph Reyes But you also have to look at it from this perspective. Periphery hardly tours. They really don’t and they’ve said they don’t. Misha is right if you consider that they don’t tour. So in Misha’s case he does need a side hustle. Cuz he doesn’t prioritize torturing
Joseph I mean Misha has his hands in so many projects musically… And not just music… GGD and horizon devices… On top of so many others we aren’t even aware of yet.
Eric Arthur Villarreal yeah and super rich mommy and daddy that have supported him with super expensive equipment and lessons at a young age lol.
Joseph Reyes that’s because Misha is a trust fund baby. It’s insulting for him to give advice on money to actual struggling artists. Welcome to the Internet there’s a lot of information on here.
Joseph Reyes periphery is way bigger than fit for a king lmfao
Just hit Google and look into that for yourself lol
It’s 2 diefferent approaches neither is more right than the other. Ir’s also alot harder for a Prog band to get big then a Metalcore band.
Samwise Kindall my thoughts exactly. I love both bands, but Periphery is not exactly a band to be liked by everyone. FFAK writes much more commercial metal nowadays, to be honest. Periphery are music nerds writing music for music nerds mostly.
Noe Anton To be fair that to your 2nd point this is why Misha has multiple revenue streams
Fit for a king is 5 guys dancing in front strobe lights and a backtrack. We don’t care what background dancers have to say
Kyle Mancuso yeah, that’s not even remotely true. How about understanding music and actually watching the band you’re talking about.
Brian Olson I’ve unfortunately had to sit through that. My 7 year old could learn anything in their catalogue. Weak shit
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FFAK absolutely grinded to be where they are. It seemed like they were coming through 2 or 3 times a year and were constantly putting out new, great material.
Meanwhile, Misha was concerned with plugins, endorsements, personal brand building, etc. Nolly left to do the same, Matt Halpern launched Band Happy, and etc.
FFAK focused on the band as a whole and the Periphery guys focused on side quests.
Curtis Hewitt II well no, Periphery has been around the block much more than FFAK. Periphery is entirely all self financed and published which includes touring. FFAK has a massive record label fronting the costs and is the exception, not the rule.
Spencer Sheldon right, but that doesnt make them a bigger band.
Curtis Hewitt II I know. FFAK is a much larger band and has all their costs absorbed by the record label, not the band.
Spencer Sheldon okay, but we arent discussing that. We are talking about why the band is bigger. While you’re not wrong, thats not the topic.
Curtis Hewitt II actually no, the entire reason this article was posted was due to a discussion on music as a career, with Misha saying musicians should have income sources other than the music itself. Tuck, being a meathead, insulted Misha and said “just budget bro”. And Spencer pointed out that Tuck’s budget is handed to him by his record label.
FFAK is a bigger band, for some reason. But that actually was not the original subject.
Curtis Hewitt II the article is about touring costs.
Curtis Hewitt II Periphery had to do “Sidequests” because Prog metal is not as lucrative as metalcore as a genre. Imagine Corey from trivium shitting on Paul Waggoner from BTBAM. Yeah no shit trivium is bigger than BTBAm BTAMM knows they are performing for a nicche audience and are Ok with that
Samwise Kindall im not denying that
Aaaand now I know Tuck is kind of a douchebag for that response
I bet this FFAK guys can’t play Wax Wings 😅
“Not a fucking idiot and makes a living touring” – Guy who nobody gives af about.
Great speech guy.
Ffak is the most generic monster energy bs that edgy right wing kids listen to.
ffak better anyways
Chris Stevens-Nettles who?
Nicholas Crosbie who?
Chris Stevens-Nettles negative
George Bruno’s Voice periphery has never been good. Unless you think only drop tuning is good. Then they are the best. They are only a fun band to listen to if you’re a guitarist, if you’re not a guitarist it is a boring nothing burger.
Misha wouldnt know a tube screamer if he saw one. (Based on a true story)
Vee Koroghlian what
Dang that Tuck guy is pissed ! 🤣
Blair Bondy he’s 5’4 what do you expect. Dudes a micro dick head.
Shawn Moran idk anything about all of that lmao
For context. Nik Noc interviewed Misha who expressed musicians should seek multiple form of income. Doing lessons, selling tabs and the like. Touring costs are going up and musicians are making less than ever. Its certainly possible to make a career out of just the music but for sustainability, keep the music pure and dont be scared to venture out. (My quick summary of the interview)
I’ve always thought Mishas take was logical, if you’re that type of musician. We all see it, but it makes sense. Even like, multi instrumentalist/bedroom projects. You kinda gotta be everything anyway. Marketing, production, video editor, the music part, and so on. Depending how far you wanna take it it, at that. But as an example, I agree with him. If you approach it that way, fuck it man. Homie just needs to delve more. No malice toward him. I’m saying this baseless, didn’t read the thing. But, its alittle more logical in that realm as a musician. Can’t hate on everyone’s grind if it yields them results.
I think I’m prepared to die in these comments haha
It’s a shame that periphery isn’t bigger. They are literally one of the OG‘s when it comes to progressive metal! They are insanely talented and highly underrated! But Misha is right, the vast majority of musicians (even signed bands) do not make enough through music and merch alone to sustain themselves.
Those that do make enough off of music are few and far between in the metal scene and very lucky.
Tuck is a little out of touch and must be forgetting the grind and his privilege.
And being aggressive over an honest answer from Misha just because it was different from his experience is absolutely insane.
FFAK has some good songs but all their stuff sounds the same to me. He got lucky with his cookie cutter metal and it went to his head
Alivia Grace Ely They could if they wanted, they’ve said plenty of times that writing music and touring is a drag. Good on them for pivoting into other shit but plenty of bands crushing it now, surpassed them easily in less time.
Alivia Grace Ely I’m not disagreeing with your overall assessment except the OG comment. There have been progressive metal bands decades before Periphery.
Alivia Grace Ely periphery is far from underrated
Alivia Grace Ely OGs of prog metal? You mean a genre that existed 20 years before Periphery ever formed?
Robyn Chronister i was speaking more in terms of modern prog metal, especially with the big shift in the genre in the late 00s/early 10s. I know prog has been around a lot longer, but every generation or so there is a shift in the genres where it starts to be redefined and I feel like Periphery was one of the bands to mark that shift in Prog in that time. 🫶
Alivia Grace Ely lucky is 100% right. You can grind three times harder than FFAK, be more talented and better than FFAK in every measurable way, and still not achieve a fraction of their success. That’s just the way of the world. Metal history is absolutely littered with the carcasses of incredible bands that for one reason or another, couldn’t make a living from it. This “bassist” is completely full of himself and out of touch.
Quick thought here:
Most of you don’t do music professionally and have no experienced to have an opinion on who’s right and who’s wrong.
But hey, opinion away..
John Fox there’s is no right and wrong, though. That’s what’s so hilarious about it. It’s 2 dudes in 2 different bands with 2 vastly different experiences with said band and touring and merch etc. Periphery was never meant to make a living. It was always FFAK’s goal. So it’s 2 different experiences with 2 different pov’s
John Fox two different avenues to the same destination.
“Just charge double for a shirt bro” my brother in Christ I am not paying $40-50 for a black gildan tshirt with three colors
My least favorite member of FFAK
Go back to spinning in circles and singing like shit big bro
Tuck is completely missing the point. It is extremely hard to making a living with a band, and almost all bands that aren’t absolutely massive have to diversify. I could go on and on but Tuck’s advice is terrible. The reality is you MUST diversify to bring in more revenue.
Wow, someone really hurt that guy, huh?
I can’t take tuck seriously anymore lol. How childish you gotta be to call someone a fucking idiot just cause you have a different point of view? Must be a liberal
Cody Tidwell what does this have to do with being liberal or not lol. You know misha is a liberal right? What a weird take
Nicholas Crosbie like fish in a barrel
Cody Tidwell you ok?
Tuck is right. Bottom line is FFAK twice the setlist, shows, monthly listeners. PLENTY of bands are crushing it right now on just music and touring. Obviously you should diversify, that goes with out saying, but to say there’s no money in touring braindead lazy L take.
Marcel Diaz So I guess Adam D never went to school for Audio Production and just always played shows with KSE. Forget the fact he produced most of the biggest metalcore albums of the late 2000s and early 2010s
Mishas lifestyle if anyone follows reflects these comments lol. Maybe for him and his lifestyle it doesn’t make sense, but for someone more modest it does. Who cares either way, if someone is doing what they love and can afford their lifestyle doing it.. good. I don’t know why anyone cares.
IDK bro I wouldn’t tell a millionaire like Misha how to make money 😂🤷 …I suspect FFAK touring money is not the same as Misha side hustle money 🤑
Wild to get all uppity over Misha saying have a backup plan lol
Isaiah Finney that’s because Misha is a trust fund baby. It’s insulting for him to give advice on money to actual struggling artists. Welcome to the Internet there’s a lot of information on here. 
Brian Jordan no, it’d be insulting if he were saying jump in you’ll be fine and make enough money to survive. He could do that but you’re average Joe cant. So suggesting to new musicians to have a safety net is respectable opinion. Tuck on the other hand is obviously not counting his blessings lol. Dude joined FFAK after they found major success and has road that wave for years now.
Periphery is definitely the better band of the two 🤷♂️
Chris McComb Yeah FFAK had one decent album, one great album, and the rest are basically unlistenable trash.
Periphery on the other hand has all hits no shits.
Regardless of streams and general popularity, I’ve never met someone who said FFAK was their favorite band. I’ve met more people than I can remember that said Periphery was their favorite band🤷♂️
Dakota James this !!
Dakota James I know lots of people who absolutely LOVE both. Just because they wanna bicker, doesn’t mean it has anything to do with a versus comparison. Numbers wise, FFAK has about double the following. I think both bands are absolutely incredible.
Who has a single favorite artist by the time they’re an adult? I could maybe, if I tried really really hard, narrow it down to a top 10. Or maybe a top 3 or 4 per genre.
Mike Schwabauer A lot of people do, even if it’s just a current favorite, but I’m with you. I’m more likely to forget to name one of my favorite bands than come up with an accurate top 20. I was essentially explaining the illusion of Periphery being more popular than FFAK. Periphery has a more vocal & dedicated fan base despite less overall listeners.
Dakota James You were never in a outh grough remember FFAK started as a christian metalcore band which is also a niche
Samwise Kindall I was and I remember! I played in a youth worship band all through high school😆 Used to jam all the Solid State records stuff.Media: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4430046640654733&set=p.4430046640654733&type=3
Dakota James So was I but I was jamming P1 and Weightless while others were jamming Relient K and Underoath. I am a pastors kid lol
Samwise Kindall Where I grew up there were separate groups. 2000s hipster skate kid types then the guys into heavy stuff. I used to play with a lot of Facedown records bands and brought For Today to play my hometown. It was a great time to grow up! Here I am in Black Dahlia Murder shirt covered up by a Before their Eyes hoodie at Youth group service😆Media: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4430065740652823&set=p.4430065740652823&type=3
Tuck is literally only known for being the bass swinger in FFAK and not actually playing it live for most of their shows run time.
Ashton Flint quite literally have only seen videos of him swinging the bass around. 🤦🏻♂️
Ashton Flint I’ve said this before so many times I’ve lost friends over it, but I’ll say it again. I don’t trust Christian metal. It’s pandering. In every word of every lyric. No matter how clever The Lyricist is. I will say I am a Fit For A King fan musically. Just like I loved As I Lay Dying to a point in my youth and not that I would ever talk down on somebody’s spiritual journey it has more to deal with a general sense of self-righteousness that tends to turn anybody into the exact conversational exchange at hand. Love Misha. Love Periphery. And I can resonate with what he’s saying but what we’re looking at here is two completely levels of being in a band. The level of influence Misha has had on music and will continue to do so will never be trumped by most bands let alone somebody with an ulterior message. And I don’t necessarily think either of these people are wrong in their perspective it’s just what they know. And we’re all destined to succumb to a bit of drama when it comes to dying on hills. Stoked for new nasty from both artists. But they both have a point. Different plectrum strokes for different plectrum folks. To conclude my Gestalt I will say the only thing that really sticks out to me is the fact that the art really does get lost when people are trying to survive doing what they love in a world that we’re living in today. If anything I’m just proud of both of these bands for even existing anymore. You really got to believe in what you’re doing to keep it up as long as either band has. So respect for that. Just glad Heavy Music is where it’s rn at despite everything. We worship a thick book of nasty riffs and some chapters are messy. But I promise we have all proven to care about this nonsense more than they do which is why they’re on stage. Rant end. Smiles.
FFAK is genuinely garbageslop and that’s why they’re popular
A true Tuck Fard.
I like both musicians, but I think the tone Tuck uses is kinda weird. I play in a local band who‘s trying to tour abroad a bit more, and I can confirm that it is expensive. I‘d rather hear him explaining further how FFAK tours for the living with this high production cost. Especially if you play thousands miles away from your home town.
Guy is disconnected frfr
How to lose a fan in one post. Periphery is infinitely more talented than FFAK.
Insulting because your experience is different is just stupid. Especially to a legend like Misha.
Tuck Deez nuts, bro.
Misha and Periphery are the roadmap for making money as a band in the modern era. I’ve followed them since 2011 and seen them blow up and dominate their respective spaces in signature gear, plugins, pedals, courses, etc… it’s silly to nitpick them on one comment.
Connor Noteboom that’s because Misha is a trust fund baby. It’s insulting for him to give advice on money to actual struggling artists. Welcome to the Internet there’s a lot of information on here.
Connor Noteboom but he’s here telling you they don’t make shit , he has to do side hustles , if you have to do that do Not Follow their “road map”
It’s easy to make money when you are already rich before starting the band 🤷🏻♂️
FFAK sucks, they rely on TONS of backup tracks live, their singer stops screaming and the scream continues for an extra 2 bars, that band is fake as fuck
Imagine being upset that Misha’s trying to mentor a younger generation of musicians to learn a life lesson without having to learn it first by experiencing it. Why not have side hustles? I mean a lot of big Bands have members with quite a few side hustles.
Tuck is completely out of touch and doesn’t understand the reality of the business for many smaller bands with a lot less popularity. He honestly sounds really jealous that Misha’s created a brand for himself outside of his band.
FFAK is laughably mediocre and wants to bow up to a titan? Let your guitarist go back to Phinehas where he was making good music, and maybe this bassist should go join a pop band. No one would notice he left.
The guy who does the cringey bass spin thing?
Misha>Tuck
Dude sounds jealous because he can’t riff like Misha.
Why would you ever insert yourself in a discussion in this manner? This discussion has so many broadstrokes. You would have to reduce things to more specific contexts before you could get into right/wrong territory.
Well, that’s one way of letting everyone know you’re soft.
Easy money when you play edgy butt rock.
Oh hell yeah where’s my caramel popcorn!
Misha’s got a solid point, meanwhile tuck just sounds like he’s upset Nik isn’t interviewing him
Misha owns a $230,000 Porsche 🤷
Ryan Yates Which he got from his multiple revenue streams which is ok
Samwise Kindall that’s my point. Or you can just tour and sell $80 t shirts and drive a beater.
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Fit For a King fucking SUCKS. All they do is put out music that sounds like the ACTUAL popular metal at any given time ….fucking over opinionated poser
Just remember misha has always been wealthy… he just decided to dabble in music before starting a company. We’re comparing a tourbus and hotel band to a sleeping in a van showering at planet fitness band
Jared Kohr and the one who stays in the van sounds better than the one in the tour bus any day.
Not according to the listeners, the metric that actually matters.
that’s because Misha is a trust fund baby. It’s insulting for him to give advice on money to actual struggling artists. Welcome to the Internet there’s a lot of information on here.
Fit for a king can barely play their instruments. It’s not far off from Asking Alexandria
Waaaahhhhh im broke and i drive an audi waaaaaahhhhhhh lol
He’s literally just proved Misha’s point. Diversify
Jimmy Holman but who is taking lessons from anyone in FFAK? 😆
Throwing shade at Misha is supreme saltiness. The dude is a G
Didn’t Tuck Join FFAK after they had already become a headlining band & had been signed to Solid State Records (one of the largest possible metal labels) for years already? I guess your opinion would be a bit different when you’re riding in someone else’s car
Didn’t Misha only a trust found baby who never had to struggle with money? Kinda ironic from him
Fit for a King’s first real headline tour didn’t come until Dark Skies came out
Tuck is half the reason FFAK is as big as they are, that guy’s an absolute workhorse.
I guess your opinion would be a bit different when you’re favorite prog band gets called out for being out of touch, though
Noble Kareem Nassar he joined when they had some traction but weren’t necessarily massive yet. Around Slave to Nothing iirc
Well when fit for a king isn’t a basic bitch band lemme know tuck. Misha is a legend and innovated so much for the scene. Last person who should talk is any member of fit for king🤣🤣
Nick Shupe the Mac book in the band plays more than he does
Ayyyyyeee facts dude! Hahahah
Good morning Tuck. Yes it’s me your Bosom Buddie. Now tell me Tuck: has your Sphincter ever Blasted a Nuclear-Grade Supersonic Liquified TURBO-Shart before
I have no idea how anyone could listen to Misha and think any of it is a bad idea.
It’s good advice and it works for many other musicians. There is a reason so many musicians stream or have YouTube or run other companies.
I mean did periphery not tour all the time in the beginning of their career? Can we not elevate how we choose to do our careers on a daily basis. I don’t see the problem here. Like what even is this drama about.
Salty af lmao
Imagine writing soft brained b side music like Fit For A King and trying to throw shade at Misha fucking Mansoor. 😭😭😭
Misha’s advice is not just good for musicians. It’s good for everyone. Side hustles and multiple streams of income are a smart way to make money. I do music for the love of. I lay tile and renovate bathrooms to put food on my families table. I invest into a few other forms of side hustles so I don’t have to lay tile until I’m 70.
All my side ventures allow me to take 3 months off of work in the winter and play nintendo with my kids.
Side hustles, yall!
I had never heard of, nor listened to FFAK until 5 minutes ago. First thought that entered my mind: this feels like the butt rock version of modern metal. Hard pass.
As for the topic at hand, I don’t see what’s so objectionable about Misha’s statements. He’s just offering some advice on what’s a pretty commonly understood problem touring musicians face. Even if you disagree with his conclusion (and think he’s too wealthy to have a valid opinion), I don’t get the hostility — and on Twitter, no less. Is the guy rage-baiting for engagement or something?
Crazy that the guy from the “Christian” band is being such an asshole over something he disagrees with. Definitely not a typical thing these days.Media: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=27254407827511668&set=p.27254407827511668&type=3
Periphery has small audience, cause they play prog metal, fanbase is everything.
Man alive, Misha has been nothing but transparent about periphery (which he said doesn’t make a lot of money but it’s what he and everyone loves!) and his other side projects…..
Tbh this isn’t even news, it’s called diversifying into different aspects of music! Smart would be the words I’d use!
I can honestly see both sides to this but in Tucks defense, FFAK tours way more frequently than Periphery.
Oh boy ruined fit for a king with his gay ass vocals
Yall are missing the argument. Misha is the trust fund kid who’s telling the diy guy who’s been touring for 15 years that you shouldn’t put everything jnto the music do other stuff etc…this is what happens when u start with money and the band is more of a side project to the rest of your life…misha PERIPHERY IS YOUR SIDE HUSTLE. All that other shit is what makes ur money. You tour 15 days every 5 years. I totally think his take should have been like “we don’t focus on touring because the moneys not there so don’t ask me about tour economy, we spend our time on other stuff that generates more money.” Period. I promise you FFAK toured more in one year that periphery has their whole existence. Also, Misha is not entirely wrong. To be a happy successful touring band you have to do other stuff on your down time. I also think mishas argument is flawed. Every other “outlet” he talks about is still connected to the music industry. I think balance is totally using ur down time not doing something with the band or music at all. So every band needs to do lessons, get your own blah blah…this wouldn’t work…no one would care. Yea yall did it first clap clap. 👏. To say this is the template is way off. You can not repeat this set up and have a good shot at doing it. The 5th band to copy this would get laughed into the internet abyss… like this band has Godly drums instead of get good drums etc…the point is a bunch of trust fund kids telling real hxc diy kids how it should work. When they started at the top cause of the 💰. Misha was going to start a company, how many ppl u know in hxc bands that are ceos??? 😝 Misha puts money into periphery like I did when I was in my first band in high school because I could! FFAK is trying to generate money from FFAK. Diversify your portfolio, understand the band will be ups and downs and structure your down time doing something else besides music that makes money and hopefully possibly brings u joy. Putting ur tools in one bag (music industry) is not the way to go.
I have been making a great living off of music for over 5 years, I’ve got 6 streams of income, 5 of them being related to music. Misha is 100% right if you don’t learn how to diversify your one source of income is gonna shit the bed eventually and you’ll be left with crumbs. That’s one of the big reasons why you’re gonna see a musician do well for 1 or 2 years and then stop hearing about them.
Guy in a christian band talking shit. Lol
😴
The point of the podcast was to talk to misha on periphery, their experiences, and new album. And they did that. And it all felt like honest advice. Don’t feed into this
You can make endless stipulations and qualifiers for your opinion and idiots like Tuck will still get pissy
FFAK has no original members? Why did everything leave? Lmao maybe money?
What a cunt. It’s unhealthy? How about the non helpful bullshit you just spouted off? How is any of that helpful to anyone? Also fit for a king is crap.
I’ve seen FFAK twice in 1 year in Toronto… They are definitely grinding to climb the ladder, focusing on partnering up, scaling their concerts… There is no right or wrong, band members pursue their own way to make a living